Shadowrun Pub
Shadowrun RPG => SR3 (Shadowrun 3rd Edition) General Discussion => Topic started by: bull30548 on August 19, 2007, 10:57:55 PM
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Ok here is the question regarding 3rd edition Shadowrun.
An adept cannot have more levels in a power than the adept's Magic Attribute. For example, and adept with Magic 4 cannot have more than 4 points worth of power, none of which can have more than four levels.
During game play, adepts may purchase additional Power Points at a cost of 20 Good Karma Points per Power Point.
Page 168 Shadowrun 3rd edition rules
So how are you supposed to purchase more power points if you can't have more powers than magic attribute?
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Initiate and raise your magic level?
-kv
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Well the next paragraph says
During game play, adepts may purchase additional Power Points at a cost of 20 Good Karma Points per Power Point.
page 168 Shadowrun 3rd edition
Um so how the heck does that work?
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That '20 point' section is for those people that do not have Magic In The Shadows, and either don't want to, or can't use the Initiation rules.
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Ok that makes even less sense the Magic in the Shadows was supposed to be supplemental rules not complete rewrite of the rules. I think the main problem is that Adepts have never been all that well defined. If you read there is tons on full magicians. Aspected and Adepts not so much actually.
I mean they don't even clearly define why an adept would want to initiate for anyway. More Power Points, use the guidelines in the main rules. Higher Magic rating? Why most of their powers don't even need a spell pool. Metamagic feats? There are only a few out there and those are useful. Changing our Auras? Sure could be useful if I worried about background count or being hunted by mages. Getting rid of Geasa? Ok you might want to get rid of those if you have any. My question is why do you have one in the first place?
I just would like a better game information definition they have plenty story out there for them but not a whole lot game rules wise.
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For SR3, SOtA64 (State of the Art 2064) was a really good source for depth on Adepts.
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question if a adept or mundane take sorcery spell defense can they actruly benifit form it I would say yes
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question if a adept or mundane take sorcery spell defense can they actruly benifit form it I would say yes
Nope! In SR4, a mundane (or even non-Mystic Adept) cannot even learn any active Magical Skills (or Resonance Skills for that matter).
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well that makes no sense at least for a pysical adept
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Well think of it this way- they're not learning magic as much as they're perfecting thier own phsycial prowness. Adpets aren't aware of magic in the same way that mages and shamans are- hence the insult "groggy," a word for someone who's almost awakened, but not yet.
Giving adepts spell defense would make them pretty invincible- they could be as fast and strong as a troll, go toe to toe with a street sam, and shrug off spells? I'd say they couldn't have it, just for game balance.
-kv
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Nope! In SR4, a mundane (or even non-Mystic Adept) cannot even learn any active Magical Skills (or Resonance Skills for that matter).To be more correct, they can't learn Magical Skills as Active Skills, but can take them as Knowledge Skills. Same skill, just not able to use it yourself. (The way you worded it, they simply can't take them at all.)
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Are you not able to use knowledge skills at 1/2 for active skills in 4th edition? I don't know 4th edition as well as 3rd (since I'm poor and cannot invest in books like Street Magic), but I thought that one had made the cut.
-kv
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Not sure what you're referring to. In 3rd Edition it was assumed you had the Background Knowledge Skill of all your Active Skills at one-half their rating, representing the background knowledge you picked up in the course of training and learning that skill. A later rule also occasionally let you use certain Knowledge Skills as a Complimentary Skill for Active Skills (ie, giving you a chance for another success or two)... but that's about as close as I can remember.
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And no, SR4 does not have that rule. Although there is a suggestion that appropriate Knowledge Skills could be rolled and the 'hits' be added as a Dice Pool modifier to the Active test.
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Well think of it this way- they're not learning magic as much as they're perfecting thier own phsycial prowness. Adpets aren't aware of magic in the same way that mages and shamans are- hence the insult "groggy," a word for someone who's almost awakened, but not yet.
Giving adepts spell defense would make them pretty invincible- they could be as fast and strong as a troll, go toe to toe with a street sam, and shrug off spells? I'd say they couldn't have it, just for game balance.
-kv
LOL.. adpets... heheheheheh!!!
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see my reasoning is alot of Py adepts have undergone rigerious mental traing and disapline so would not that apply to resisting spell at least mind affecting ones
sure elemental no but mind effecting ones I would say yes
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Ok here is the question regarding 3rd edition Shadowrun.
An adept cannot have more levels in a power than the adept's Magic Attribute. For example, and adept with Magic 4 cannot have more than 4 points worth of power, none of which can have more than four levels.
During game play, adepts may purchase additional Power Points at a cost of 20 Good Karma Points per Power Point.
Page 168 Shadowrun 3rd edition rules
So how are you supposed to purchase more power points if you can't have more powers than magic attribute?
The way I interpreted that rule is that adepts aren't restricted in the number of power points they purchase - but after a certain point they might not be able to spend them.
Let's look at the above example, an adept having a Magic Rating of 4. This means (s)he has 4 power points to spend on powers. (S)he could purchase Killing Hands, or Magic Resistance, or Improved Physical Attribute, or any other combination of powers as long as (s)he does not exceed a total cost of 4 power points. In addition, none of these powers can have more than four levels; so they couldn't get 5 ranks of Pain Resistance, for example.
If the adept purchases another power point (by spending 20 karma), they can use it to gain extra powers - but they still can't exceed four levels in any one power. So they could end up with Improved Reflexes 3 (which costs 5 power points), or they could have Pain Resistance 4 (2 points), Combat Sense 1 (1 point), and Enhanced Perception 4 (2 points), for example.
If the adept initiates, it increases their Magic Rating by a point (to 5) and would also give them an additional power point. Thus in this case they could have up to five levels in a power.
Why initiate? To get a Magic Rating of 9 and have Pain Resistance 9 - don't get any penalties until you're unconscious... It also costs less than 20 karma per level (at least for the first level if self-initiating, or to level four if group initiating, not including ordeals).
As for spell-defence, Fortune's comment stands for SR3 as well. Page 160 of SR3 explicitly states "While adepts and mundanes can learn magical Background Skills, they cannot manipulate mana and cannot use Active Magic Skills"
Adepts can't get spell defence, but they can get the power of Magic Resistance for a cost of .5 power points per level.
Kid, I thought 'groggies' referred to Aspected magicians? The 'half awakened' part refers to their ability to only use one magical skill (usually Sorcery or Conjuring).
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I think Poison hit it on the nose.
I just looked at the section and the first line says "An adept cannot have more levels in a power than the adept's Magic Attribute." This line leads me to believe they can have many powers but no single power can have a rating higher than the magic attribute.
The next line reads "For example, an adept with Magic 4 cannot have more than 4 points worth of powers, none of which can have more than four levels." The line confuses me a little bit. Literally it says if an adept has Magic 4 then they can only have 4 power points to spend on powers, which contradicts the first line and the line afterwards about purchasing more power points.
Personally I look at it as a typo, it's like one person writes line 1 and 3 and a different person wrote the second line. Following the majority rules idea, that's 2 lines versus 1 so I'd say you can buy as many powers as you want but you can't have any powers with a higher rating than your magic attribute.
Of course in my games I usually follow the second line just so adepts don't become demi-gods. ;)
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so at charter creation if you bought more power points and long as the the number of powers dont excede your mgic rateing you could purces enough power points to max evverything
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so at charter creation if you bought more power points and long as the the number of powers dont excede your mgic rateing you could purces enough power points to max evverything
At character creation you get power points equal to your magic rating, and no other way of purchasing more. For example 4 magic rating means 4 power points.
AFTER you start playing the character and start accumulating karma, you can buy additional power points at 20 karma per point but cannot increase any power to a rating higher than your magic rating. That means if you have a magic rating of 4, the max you can have pain resistance at is rating 4. Keep in mind that a GM will usually require the adept to get some kind of training in order to buy new powers that they previously didn't have. It wouldn't make sense for an adept to suddenly know how to kill people by poking them in the neck with their finger unless someone taught them how to do it.
When an adept initiates to increase their magic rating, the get a free power point at each level IIRC.