Shadowrun Pub
Shadowrun RPG => History & Politics => Topic started by: Ruski on June 10, 2005, 10:44:25 AM
-
So, what do you think will be the current events that make it into the footnotes of the next version of shadowrun?
any outstanding runs pulled that you thinkwill make it into the books?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
You mean besides the whole 'terrorist attack on the Matrix' thing?
-
well, perhaps that one's a given... but what else?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Um... Let's see here... The mana storms in Australia grow weaker, however, a plague of strange free spirits that feed on dark emotions ravage the country-side?
-
LOL so, if they are related to decreasing mana-storms, it's time to become a storm chaser...
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Gabe isn't here, so I guess it's safe to talk.
In the Horrors sourcebook, the "dragon creation myth" states that Nighthunter, the dragon-like being that created "life" left "across the world" to spawn it's creations: Dragons, Name-givers, and the like. The "other side of the world" is quite similar to "the land down under" which leads me to believe that the nature of Australia's manastorms has more to do with how Corrupted that area had been during the 2nd or 4th worlds.
-
mother nature astrally purging herself with some prune juce mojo huh?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
I suspect a 9/11 will occuar
-
a terrorist attack in the outback? what are they going to crash their plane into? a pack of dingos?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Ayer's Rock! But then again, it IS a rock.. so I don't think they'll be so successful.
-
well, perhaps they were terrorizing some people from UCAS on their way to newzeland, and ended up in austrilia in the outback?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
I simply wonder how powerful Wuxing HQ's background count is by then...
-
perhaps they found a way to contain it?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
ooooo, so what happens if a team of sappers does make it over to Ayers Rock and blows big chunks out of it or worse? That would not bode well I'm thinking.
-
What if some people dig up Ayer's Rock and it floats? :o!!!!
-
What if they build a floating city on it?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
D00d that's kewl, I'm sooo gonna use that. Ayer's rock floats, and some megacorp (prolly Ares) has claimed it and made it into a floating airbase. They've also devised a system to make it move in the direction they want to.
-
So, what sort of security would they have on the floating city? how would shadowrunners break in? launch themselves on rockets at the underside, and from there rockclimb to the top where the city is? or would they have to climb up through the internal cave system, filled with paranormal goodies? what would the job be? smuggle a nega-mage into the center of the rock, and have him walk through the spirit power-source, and there drop a magical-gernade of some sort?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Nope, not Ares... the Unseelie Court of Tir Nan Og orders a strategic suborbital strike force of Hunter-Killer Adepts and Rating 16 conjurers to slaughter the spirits residing there whom arrive on a fleet of suborbital ships ritually and sacrificially quickened with a Force 20 Armor spell with 20 successes? So twenty magicians use blood magic and inflct small cuts on themselves.
Hrm, all the magiicians resist against a Force 1 spell?
Here comes the Enemy...
-
Yea, that could go badly.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
No kidding. Suddenly the number of "Storm Wraiths" go up in the Outback...
-
or, there's a huge manastorm that dosn't stop, and just kinda wanders arround the globe destroying cities.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
One word: Ghostwalker. I think a dragon who seems to summon great-form spirits almost as an accident would have quite a bit to say about Ayers Rock and the spirits thereon. Think about a powerful free spirit from the outback taking his case to Ghostwalker in Denver and pleading for help. The dragon decides that enough is enough and sends “assistance” in the form of some REALLY nasty spirits, loyal wizards, bleeding-edge tech, and some deniable assets. This could well be the setting for the next “quiet” war. Of course all of the mojo flying around would exacerbate the mana storms and, WHAM! Instant “really bad” situation.
Gabriel
-
So, what 'really bad' forms would the mana storms take?
like the stay-puffed marshmellow man from ghostbusters?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Well, first of all, it would have to be one of those invisible storms that you only see the effect of and not some big flashy show. Say an effect could be a Control Emotion effect that causes feelings of paranoya and induces insanity. You would have inexplicable waves of homical violence sweep huge areas. And remember, there are HIVES in the outback, mate. Think of an entire colony of ants or termites going on a rampage all at once because the storm affected their hive mind mentality. OUCH!
Gabriel
-
wait... that sounds like seattle!
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Or maybe a mana storm with a summoning effect. As it passes over the area spontaneous manifestations start going out of control. Depending on the area, this could be BAD NEWS. For instance, a storm like this passing over a costal area could summon a ton of sea and river spirits that go on a rampage and tear into whatever is on the water, including boats, ships, house-boats, and arcoblock. Or say the storm passes over an area that is having a small brush fire. Instant slamanders and fire elementals start popping up and now you have a HUGE brush fire.
Gabriel
-
that would be pretty cool... a wall of spirits...
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Tricky, but manastorms don't produce spirits because the "domain" that a manastorm represents is already occupied by Storm Wraiths. I can however, speculate that if Ghostwalker were to do something drastic, the effect would be like Wild Magic in Lost Angeles.
My speculation is that storm wraiths are actually a form of "Primordial Horror" that is to say, they don't need to feed on emotions and aren't aspected towards people because they are still in a "larval" state and feeding on the mana storm.
-
:::groan::: Oh yeah, Retread is the ShadowDawn guy. I almost forgot about that...
But seriously, I forgot about the storm wraiths being aspected to the mana storms. But you get the idea I'm pushing here about a huge manastorm with only one effect and how you could use it to creat utter havoc and destruction. How about a manastorm that only effects infants. Give it a Magic Fiingre affect and key it into emotion and all of a sudden you have cars being flung around whenever a baby gets pissed off (like when it's hungry, thristy, needs changing, sees something it doesn't like, hears something it doesn't like, or just because) and you get the idea.
Gabriel
-
Whoa... super trippy.
how about a woman's lib storm?
all women have their stats effectivly doubled for the period of the storm.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Actually, you could do that. The spells are there in the book. Just have it aspected to women and you have one BAD-HOOP manastorm of nagging waiting to happen. ;)
Gabriel
-
or better yet have them stat thier pierods at the same time time for the guys to go camping for a month
-
A menstration mana-storm??? :-\ I damn sure son't want to see what THOSE storm wraiths look like. :-X
Gabriel
-
"I look 'Tired' do I!?"
BAMF!
-
Ayer's Rock! But then again, it IS a rock.. so I don't think they'll be so successful.
Remember that in Shadowrun, Uluru (Ayer's Rock) is some sort of extra-dimentional prison holding big bad nasties. Twist (Sam Verner) unknowingly released Spider (not the totem, but a powerful Spirit-type creature) in the second SR novel, setting up the events in the third novel and the necessity of a second Great Ghost Dance.
-
oh yea...
well, perhaps it could try to be harnased by some of the less caring corps? as a sort of... energy source?
-RuskiFace the PIrate
-
Or even a free spirit or dragon. You never know what something like that could do with all that mojo.
Gabriel
-
certanly seems like you could do something with it...
or, perhaps they could sky-hook it into the stratosphere, and slingshot it into the sun.
*shrug*
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Well what else would you do with a flaoting mountian??
Gabriel
-
Uh... play beach-boys really loud from on top of it?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Woo! "Little Ol' Lady from Pasadena!"
-
Just hink about he the background count on that thing?? I can't imagine you could really do much astrally on a floating mountian. Now, if you wanted something that was resistant to magic, the BC might be helpfull. Then you put a drek-load of jet engines on the thing, some bleeding edge navigation and weapon systems, and BAM! Instant Shield Helicarrier. ;)
Gabriel
-
I like the idea of a moble flying fortress.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
It would never happen. Too big of a target. One Thor shot owuld take it out anyway.
Gabriel
-
It would never happen. Too big of a target. One Thor shot owuld take it out anyway.
Gabriel
Is Thor the UCAS asteroid dropping satellite?
-
well, let's say they have a reason to not fire on it.
M.A.D. anyone?
worked for the cold war.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
It would never happen. Too big of a target. One Thor shot owuld take it out anyway.
Gabriel
Is Thor the UCAS asteroid dropping satellite?
Thor Shot are mostly Corporate controlled. The known Megacorps with Thor Shot capability are Ares, S-K, and Fuchi (presumably the tech of which went to Novatech, and now NeoNET in 2070). Think big rock from space, pinpoint accuracy (or near enough), big crater!
-
wait... so they magneticly pull a rock from space to strike a target? or is it a space based laser?
now, certanly there are things that they want destroyed but don't... what if it was like a floating mercanary city or something...
a resource they could use as a deniable asset, or perhaps if it was hauling toxic spirits galore, and on the chance that it was destroyed, would release them all upon mankind?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
wait... so they magneticly pull a rock from space to strike a target? or is it a space based laser?
The tech is available now. You can google it (under Thor Shots as far as I know). It it basicallly either a rock, or a metal (usually cylendrical shaped) object, suspended in space, that is propelled towards a target on Earth, usually at the demand of the Corporate Court.
Incidently, in System Failure, Art Dunkwalther got on the receiving end of a Thor Shot from S-K, at the behest of the Court. Art's a pancake!
now, certanly there are things that they want destroyed but don't... what if it was like a floating mercanary city or something...
What?
a resource they could use as a deniable asset, or perhaps if it was hauling toxic spirits galore, and on the chance that it was destroyed, would release them all upon mankind?
Again, what?
-
I'm glad the corporate court convenes in outer space, you know, where nasty Shadow spirits and Shedim can't possess the court members...
-
I think the thor shot is resvred for hackers trying to hack z-o
-
Actually, they were first used as a deterant for terrorists in the Kingdom of Hawai'i. When one of these "warning shots" hit the ocean off the coast of Owahu, it released so much energy from the impact that it actually sparked lightning off of the water. These things don't even have warheads, they would be redundent. All they need is mass and velocity and they hit with the power of a meteor strike. You could, literally, blast a target off the face of the planet.
And the scary part of this is that the tech is very, very simple. The US government could have them floating up there right now and it is not only within the realm of possebility, would be a bit stupid if they didn't have these. A projectile that hits with the force of a meteor, leaves no fallout, can be guided in with fins, a retrorocket, and GPS transmitter, and is CHEAP. Hell, I'm surprised we even develpoed the MOAD at all.
Gabriel
-
*shrug* perhaps we do, and just haven't found a good time to use them yet?
okay, this is what i was thinking;
let's say you have a 'flying fortress' based off of the disengaged ayers rock or whatever. something that floats arround, and is protected aghinst magical assault for whatever reason.
if; for storyline reasons you let this city 'get off the ground' it wouldn't be that big of a deal to have a good reason for the corperate powers that be to 'not' destroy it.
it could have fail-safe nuclear counterattacks installed, so that it nukes the entire planet if it detects a thorshot coming down at it, or there could be political reasons, such as if the indidual corperations each had a stake in it (magical research; or a dumping ground for corperate assets that need to be moved, but not destroyed.)
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
I imagine all the nasty spirits it has trapped inside it would be deterrent enough...
-
Not if they are trapped inside. If they are able to manifest, then yeah, you have a problem. If they are trapped, who cares, right??
Gabriel
-
well, let's say if they blow it up, the previously trapped 'nastyness' gets out... that would be a good reason to not blow it up...
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
That wouldn't work, at least not for any of the non-free spirits. If you destroy the rock, you destroy the spirits. It is ther domain, after all. It's like building an archology in the middle of a prairie. By doing so, you destroy the prairie, which destroys the spirit of the prairie.
Gabriel
-
Hmm... i wonder if thats how toxic spirits come about? some spirits don't want to be destroyed, so they twist themselves to fit with the new domain?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Toxic spirits are made twisted or become twisted because their domain is corrupted by pollution, toxic waste, other nastiness, etc.
As far as I know they follow the same rules, if their domain is somehow removed then they would be removed.. unless they can somehow change their domain.
-
well, let's say their domain was destroyed by a thor-shot.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Like I said, AFAIK toxic spirits function on the spirit level like a regular spirit. So if their domain is destroyed they they are destroyed.
Then again, I never really read up on Toxic Spirits.
-
Well, I guess 'destroyed' is a relative term.
Mr. Einstine said that Matter can neither be created, or destoryed... easily...
with the example of the thorshot, all the same stuff is there, it's just crater-shaped now. you could just count that as serious a corruption as dumping toxic waste everywhere and killing all the plants...
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Well, then maybe the domain is now changed. It's no longer a prarie.. but since it's a crater maybe now it's considered mountainous? I don't think there's a crater domain.
BTW, why are we talking about toxic spirits in a thread about new tech?
-
well, we were talking about flying mountain castles and fortresses a little bit ago.
the spirit talk came about when we discussed the repercussions of lifting ayers rock out of it's happy spot on the face of the earth, and possible reasons for not blowing it up.
how about this, we start talking about solar-powered or fusion reactor based flying fortresses instead. I think i'm going to make one for my next big run.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Again, you have the same problem: it's too big and too obvious. Anyone using a helicarrier would be Target #1 for anyone who wanted to take a shot at whoever had the thing.
Gabriel
-
well, what if it was based off of the 'atlantis' research, and could go under-water to hide or something...
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
That wouldn't work, at least not for any of the non-free spirits. If you destroy the rock, you destroy the spirits. It is ther domain, after all. It's like building an archology in the middle of a prairie. By doing so, you destroy the prairie, which destroys the spirit of the prairie.
No, it's not their Domain. It's their Prison! Pretty much all the emtities trapped within are either powerful Free Spirits of some type, or (minor) Horrors. Nothing with would be restricted by Domain, or by anything if the prison were to be destroyed.
-
Ok, so all of this happens between SR3 and SR4, right???? Last I heard, wasn't it Ares who was tryingto build a launch facility on Ayars Rock and the spirits were just giving them a ton of drek for it???
Gabriel
-
I didn't read that. we were just talking about theoretically doing stuff to it.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Ah. Well Fortune seemed to be in "Shadowrun Cannon" mode and it made me wonder how we got to thsi point in the conversation. Personally, I'm wondering how many more AI's are going to pop up in SR4. And is Deus going to end up like Braniac where it can regenerate from 1 line of code and keep coming back over and over again?
Gabriel
-
*shrug* or perhaps he'll get corrupted in his regeneration and be diffrent when he shows up? or perhaps the next system crash is what finally gets rid of him?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
I'm betting on his being wiped out in the Crash 2.0 with a few of the "network" stillhanging around to create a bit of narative tension.
Gabriel
-
Man I want that book to come out!
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
a solar powered heli carrie I dont think is possible just becuase of the power requiments
now i have taken zepplins and turned them in to a small moble base
that are solor powered
-
Yeah, lots of minor Horrors appearing might be a "good thing" as people would realize the threat they present.
Why did the Big D put bequests in his will regarding simsense? Perhaps it's because the use of Moodchips can produce an effect deterrent to Horrors?
If the AR is considered another "plane" perhaps Deus is actually a new incarnation of "Horror" for that "plane?"
-
Ok, so all of this happens between SR3 and SR4, right????
I'm lost. All 'what' happens?
Last I heard, wasn't it Ares who was tryingto build a launch facility on Ayars Rock and the spirits were just giving them a ton of drek for it???
You are thinking of Killimanjaro. Nobody is doing anything with Ayer's Rock because of both the Manastorms and the Aboriginal Shamanic Fanatics.
And also because there's nothing to be gained by the Corps by doing anything there.
-
Yeah, lots of minor Horrors appearing might be a "good thing" as people would realize the threat they present.
Why did the Big D put bequests in his will regarding simsense? Perhaps it's because the use of Moodchips can produce an effect deterrent to Horrors?
If the AR is considered another "plane" perhaps Deus is actually a new incarnation of "Horror" for that "plane?"
Assuming afcourse the "Horrors are comminG!" plot will stil exist with new owners of the game line.
-
Hey Fortune,
I think you're right. I believe I am thinking of Kilamenjaro. And the "all this" I was refering to was that Ayars Rock floating around with a drek-load of trapped spirits in it. THe way you put it sounded as if it had already been written into canon.
Gabriel
-
nope, that was just us brainstorming.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
(although brainfarting may be a more accurate view)
-
Ah, gotcha. By the way, I just read that Shadows of Latin America is being solicited as a series of free DL's. Has anyone ever heard of a Shadows of Australia book being worked on? I only ask since that is the last continent that would require a "Shadows of..." book. Personally I think they will be happy with the Australia section of Target: Awakened Lands, but one can always hope.
Gabriel
-
well, if you wanted to start writing one, i'm sure we could pass it arround the P2P networks and make you famous.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
And the "all this" I was refering to was that Ayars Rock floating around with a drek-load of trapped spirits in it. THe way you put it sounded as if it had already been written into canon.
The part about Ayer's Rock being a 'Spirit Prison' has been canon since the second novel came out in around 1990.
The floating bit is ... um ... interesting, but not part of SR history, past, present, or hopefully, future. ;D
-
Ah, gotcha. By the way, I just read that Shadows of Latin America is being solicited as a series of free DL's.
They may, or may not end up being free (but probably will be). They are being used to propel the new online, subscription fiction website, Holostreets.
Has anyone ever heard of a Shadows of Australia book being worked on? I only ask since that is the last continent that would require a "Shadows of..." book. Personally I think they will be happy with the Australia section of Target: Awakened Lands, but one can always hope.
Ain't going to happen! Oz was covered to FanPro's satisfaction in Target: Awakened Lands, along with Antarctica. The only continent that really needs a sourcebook is Africa, which didn't get nearly enough print time in either Smuggler's Havens or Cyberpirates!, but that is also not going to happen. FanPro has pretty much exhausted the 'Shadows of" series, and will in the future cocetrate more on specific locations. An example of such is the soon-to-be-released Runners Havens, which will detail Seattle and Hong Kong. Four other (as yet unnamed) 'shadowrunning cities' will be covered in future releases, or at least that is the plan.
-
Probably gonna be rehashes of other books: Berlin, Sekondi, Kronstadt, Boston, Denver, etc...
-
FanPro has stated that they plan on Shadowrun being less North American centered in the future.
I'm thinking that they are going to go with London and Lisbon, with the other two being drawn from Constantinople, Vladivostok, Tokyo, Berlin, and Metropole.
Out of those five, Metropole, Tokyo, and Vladivostok are recently described (as of 2064 in SoA and SoLA), so make of that what you will. It is said that these books will be more like New Seattle in detail, if not format. We'll see.
-
Damn! I forgot about Africa. I hope nobody sues me for this. I can just see it now: "Both FEMA and Gabriel the imaginary elf have been sued by the NAACP today for racist comments regarding proud african americans."
Gabriel
-
Lord of War had a really interesting take on Sierra Lieone... scarry place, but grounds for a reaaaallly violent SR team or two (or million)
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Africa in SR is probably the most violent place in the world...
Personally, I'd like to see a Caribbean League Pirate campaign. There's a lot of room for fun and excitement.
-
Nah, they already did that. Africa is really the only big local that has been so excluded from material in SR. I'd love to see some canon data on that place.
Gabriel
-
Well there's Asamundo (sp?) - the all ghoul country that's mentioned in a couple of books (which I don't recall). And I remember Madagascar being an extremely awakened place...
-
I have what I scraped together for the Run I put my PC's through over there.
but it's not much.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Err... Gabe, Africa is described in the same source as the pirate thing mentioned. Granted, the interior is mostly unexplained. North Africa is where most of the Desert Wars happen and there is still a lot of anti-corp sabotage by Islamists in Egypt, Chad and places like that.
-
South and West africa are where all the really good stuff takes place.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Yes, the Gold and Ivory coasts. DeBeers practically runs a large portion of the place. That and Ares Arms Africa.
"Yes they do!"
--Bung
-
and anywhere where you have guns and dimonds... hmmm... that's a recipe for fun if i ever heard it!
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Most work you do for DeBeers nets you free Dikoting or other high-tech mineral wonders.
-
Everyone wants to pay you with product.
That's normally one of the things I'll walk away from in a run. I don't want to have to bother trying to move half of some super new and great salty-stuffer, I don't want the hassle of finding a buyer for some new cyberware, and I certanly don't want to carry arround a box of mojo fetish magical whatever. If you take a run because it pays you in ammo... I bet you burn through more than you pick up. plus, the numbers are deceving.
$400,000 worth of product, quickly becomes $200,000 street value, minus the 50% to move it quick, before you have to pay for another week at your local storage rental place. making it $100,000. then, when you calculate in the bribes you had to place to let the storage rental place let you store explosives without asking too many questions, buying new contacts so you could dump the stuff, hiring a decker to cover the datatrail so you don't have to worry about it coming back to bite you later, and the actual cost of preforming the run; your $100,000 turns into $50,000 ... split five ways.
so, people see that $400K tag, and think: "Wow! I'm going to be rich!" when they get the $10K at the end of the day... it's less impressive.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
True, you can always refuse though. A smart Johnson wouldn't consider paying someone in a warehouse fully of Moon Dogg-E Zap 'n' Serve Houshin Noodles, either... Though, I did know an Elf that loved that drek for some reason.
-
Well, they sometimes try to work it in... "you'll receve $40,000 worth of compensation for this job" for example.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Right, so long as they throw in the soy-sauce I'm happy.
-
you have to go shoplift your own soy-sauce packets from the 'angry panda' orental express. (they have some next to the complamentry forks you can grab if you are fast enough.)
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Right, a whole other Shadowrun to complement my reward of noodles...
-
Yup. one good Run deserves another...
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Hrm. Sounds like a good idea to me, a new variation on the "get the prototype" is "get the secret recipe"
-
Yup. If anyone has ever paid any money for a thing, there is someone else who is willing to pay you to steal it.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Or fiddle with it so that it hurts a lot of people and market-share.
-
Everyone wants to pay you with product.
<snip!>
$400,000 worth of product, quickly becomes $200,000 street value, minus the 50% to move it quick, before you have to pay for another week at your local storage rental place. making it $100,000. then, when you calculate in the bribes you had to place to let the storage rental place let you store explosives without asking too many questions, buying new contacts so you could dump the stuff, hiring a decker to cover the datatrail so you don't have to worry about it coming back to bite you later, and the actual cost of preforming the run; your $100,000 turns into $50,000 ... split five ways.
so, people see that $400K tag, and think: "Wow! I'm going to be rich!" when they get the $10K at the end of the day... it's less impressive.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
True, but you're probably better off hanging on to the stuff and selling it in due course - you remove the 50% sell fast penalty. That way it's $150K, or possibly $100K if you have to hang on for it for a while. If you're not strapped for cash, you can at least double, perhaps even triple, your payday.
-
In my runs, If PC's tryed to hold onto a warehouse full of ill-gotten salty stuffers for more than a week, things would start to go very badly for the supplies.
*shrug* that's just my evil way to motavate them to hurry up and start running again. (I don't play shadowrun to be a warehouse manager, they can go do that in the real world if they are so inclined)
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Hey, I figure, it's a role-playing game. I mean, my friends would always sell BTLs and bluebook everything against each other. Blue booking is where you write down a note and pass it to the GM. So my game quickly turned to meta-betrayal, where the player would get suspicious but I forced them to roleplay their character unknowlingly. That's great roleplaying.
-
not trusting your party is only good for so many games though.
i remember playing an 'under-dark' campaign way back when it was new and DnD was still exciting.
that atmosphere can kill friendships faster than screwing your buddy's girlfriend.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Eh, if the player's can't handle that type of game, then they weren't really friends to begin.
-
Well, perhaps you have an endless well of deep and personal relatonships to draw friends from like so much water thats all arround us.
personally, I live in a world with too few true friends. I have perhaps one or at most two buddies that would really qualify as 'friends' in that sence of the world, and even they aren't always available for a game.
inorder to pull a group together, at least for me; requires oodles of compramize. I have to let the elf pozer play an elf, and I have to let him have a magic bow. I have to make sure that certan people don't die, because if they do, they'll leave, and take the guy playing the healer with them. I have to make sure to fudge dice aghinst the people playing underpowerd PC's, so they can keep up with the munchkin with the minigun (who I fudge things aghinst, to make it hard enoug to actually be fun)
*shrug*
it's a lot of work and perhaps why I don't game as much as I'd like.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
True, fudging is necessary some times. It's hard letting characters die, that's for sure.
-
Yea. nothing kills a run like having all the PC's die. LOL
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Unless it's the last game in the campaign.
-
or the last game with that group. ever.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
You know, back to the payment with good thing, how many of you have actually been paid in cyberware that was also installed by the customer???
Gabriel
-
Er... Not many, but I did need that liver transplant and his blood type matched so...
-
I had a PC who used this situation to fill out his background. He had Aztechnology install some beta-grade bone lacing (Titanium) as part of the payment for a run in the Yucatan. When the run was done and the cargo had been delivered, the Azzies popped the cortex bombs that they had also implanted in the merc team. Klaxon's bomb didn't fully detonate, partially because of a snafu between surgeons installing his lacing and suregeons installing his cortex bomb. He ended up left for dead, but ended up in Seattle 2 y ears later with no memory of the events and a Level 8 (yes LEVEL 8!!!!!) Mexican Food Knowledge Skill and a partially detonated cortex bomb. I always thought it was good back-story, but I wondered how many others might have take the "installation" option when being paid in chrome.
Gabriel
-
People with Intelligence ratings of 1 or 2, most likely :)
-
Hehehe... funny you should mention that. I believe Klaxon had a 2 or 3 intelligence.
Gabriel
-
I expect characters with low intelligence to have histories that reflect that fact. No graduating from Yale with an intellect of 2...
-
Hell, no graduating 3rd grade with an Intelligence of 2.
Gabriel
-
Schools are like rubber stamps, you could get by with an intelligence of 2, but you'd skate by with bad grades and maybe English R/W of no more than 3, provided you don't disappear or drop out before then, as most shadowrunners are wont to do.
-
Well, a 3 is average (at least in 3rd edition), so a 2 is only a little below average... of course, 1 is total mental retardation, but I know that's one of Gabe's pet peeves, so I'll leave it alone.
In any case, think scholarship athlete or someone who gets by on borrowed fame- sons and daughters of famous or really rich people, for instance.
-kv
-
Based on what I've seen, I'd argue that you can get through school with Int 2. Int 1 might be harder, but Int 2, not too much of a problem.
-
Once again, we get into the fine detailing of a broad statistic system. Oh well. I figure if you are between normal and retarded (and that is right between them) then you are pretty damn stupid. And yeah, you might be able to get through schhol, but that's not a given.
ANYWAY, what were we talking about????
Gabriel
-
Gabe, didn't you pay attention?
;)
-
Me??? Oh come on now ROOTless, you should know me better than that by now. ;)
Gabriel
-
I can't be bothered looking through 9 pages of forum to find out the topic... but Intelligence is supposed to represent learning ability... so someone with an Intelligence of 2 would have to work harder to learn stuff than an Intelligence of 3, 4 ,etc.
That doesn't mean that they'd fail to complete <insert education level here>. It means that they'd have to work a lot harder at it than your average person, get tutoring, or the like. It's also highly unlikely (though not impossible) that they'd be able to keep up with the pace of higher learning institutions due to the amount of extra work needed.
-
Precisely, so naturally you'd spend more of your Karma learning things like Football and Dating, right?
-
Not necessarily.
For one thing, it's a lot more expensive to get, say, chemistry knowledge skill at 5 when you have an Int 0f 2 than with an Int of 5.
Also means you're more likely to make some less-than-bright choices though.
-
i.e. your PC ends up as an idiot.
Gabriel
-
Well, you don't get the bonus points at character creation.
-
i.e. your PC ends up as an idiot.
Gabriel
I'm sure I don't have Chemistry 5... so what does that say about me?
(Never you mind why I call myself Poison when I know nothing of chemistry, either! :D)
-
You know, mabye one of these days we'll hear from the Mad Chemist again and you and he can talk shop, Poison.
Gabriel
-
Trapped in a corporate facility with no way out?
Get your Face to let the guard give you a cigarette, soak the tobacco in water, strain out the leaves and allow it to dry. The brown nicotine goo left over is a potent toxin that can kill within 15 minutes.
-
Then all you need is a way to administer it and a spare 15 minutes...
-
They always say those things will kill you...
-
Yes, but in wetwork, nicotine poisoning looks sneakier than "Got head blown off by random bypasser"
Not that this situation demands wetwork, but a large enough amount of nicotine on a blade would kick the onset up to a much quicker rate. A shank is good, but a shank covered in nicotine tar will likely guarantee the person stays dead.
-
Most good shanks will make sure a person stays dead. How would you administer a nicotine dose that big? Needle would be the best way, but that track mark would show up SOOOOO easy to a medical examiner.
-kv
-
That all depends on where you inject it.
Gabriel
-
Where would you inject it that a cursory medical examination wouldn't find it?
Inside the mouth? I hear under the tongue is a trouble area.
Interior of the ocular cavity?
Under the fingernails?
Navel? Genitals?
-kv
-
Inside surface of the various private areas. Who is going to look into the end of the penis, for example, for a needle mark?? Get one long enough, and you could inject whatever yo want between near enough to the bladder to give the coroner some real trouble finding the cause.
Gabriel
-
Really, what I want to know is this:
you have your home made Nicotine toxin, that works in 15 minutes, courtisy of the guard you are planning on ganking.
How, in the name of all that is holy, are you going to take your tin cup of sludge, and inject that into the guards schlong, inorder to escape the prison, and not get caught?
"Escuse me, man, can I bum a smoke off of you?"
"Sure, you are a dead man anyways, I'll see that as your 'last request."
{taking the cig, you quickly use your chemestry four skill to extrude the nicotine from the tabaco, using nothing but toilet water and your jocky strap. }
GM: Okay, you have the toxic sludge in the bottom of a tin cup do you:
A: try to sneek it into the guard's food (why would he put his food by your cell? and why wouldn't he notice it tasted like ass?)
B: Talk him into putting it under his toung 'just for fun'
"I double-dog-dare YOU!"
C: Inject it into his Penis, so no one can figure out how he died.
"Heay man, instead of the cigurette being my last request, could I give you a BJ instead? oh! and bring that big ol' hyperdermic needle, we'll need that too!"
in all reality, if you have THAT sort of access to a person, there are any number of ways to kill them and make it look like you didn't do it.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
That's true, but I was talking specifically on how to hide an injection mark on a body. In the prison guard scenario it may be a bit... inconvinient. To say the least. But if a wife is trying to geek her chain-smoking husband, then perhaps it is a possebility. Remember, you have 15 minutes to watch him drop, wherein you can prepare a prearranged crime scene scenario. Muss things up a bit. Make it look like some kinky sex happened (to explain how you were able to secure him while you shoved a needle up his hoo-ha) and he died in the middle of it somehow. There are all kinds of ways to do this if you have the time to plan it out.
Gabriel, who does NOT smoke
-
Throw a bunch of cigarette butts around to make it look like s/he went on a smoking binge?
-
Well, mostly; Dead is dead.
the first step in realising someone is dead, is finding the body.
so, in the case of our guard, next to a recently vacated prison cell; it's not going to be a big mistery how it happened, or who they should be looking for.
they probibly won't be searching for HOW you did it for weeks, but they'll be looking for you as soon as they notice the dead body.
as for the wife / husband bit. easyest way is to still get rid of the body. melt it with acid, and hide the remains in your neighbors need cement porch. cinder-blocks in the harbor, or whatever your favorite 'burry them in the woods' scenario may be. then, when a couple of days go by, file a missing persons report. "He said he just had to take care of some stuff, and would be right back..."
no body, no murder.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
I've heard the calcium of bones is resistant to acid- does anyone know if that's true?
-kv
-
I doubt that it is resistant enough to really prevent it from disolving with enough acid. ROOTless would be the one to answer this question, but I imagine the calcium is only so basic and once you get a stronger acid, it would do the trick.
Gabriel
-
Calcium dissolves quite well in acid. So well in fact, that if you put calcium into acid, which the acid will actually dissolve enough of it to turn completely basic, and will eventually balance out at approximately 7.2 pH
The problem arrives when you want a little bit of acid to dissolve a whole lot of calcium. It just doesn’t work. The calcium neutralizes the acid, and then you are left with calcium, and water. (Or, gunk; as the case may be.)
Generally; if you take Citric Acid (Available at Home Depot) (At pH 4.0) and tried to dissolve 1 pound of calcium; you'd need about 10 gallons of the stuff; and all of it would be neutralized by the end of the process.
Anyone want to guess how much of the human body, by weight, is bone?
(About 7 - 18% (7 % if you just count the calcium content, 18% if you count the other stuff too) so your 200 lb human, will have about 14 to 36 lbs of bone matter, working out to 140 gallons of Citric Acid. (Just for the calcium in the bones))
And that's just for the skeleton. The muscle and other stuff will need to dissolve too; it just goes away a little easier.
Now, if you were to get some stronger acid it would go faster... but not by a meaningful margin.
Typically; when using acid to destroy a body; they just use it to destroy the easily identifiable face and hands; (Erasing finger prints and facial identification);
This of course is going back to the old additive: no body, no murder. If they can't prove that the body they found was the mysteriously missing Mr. Jones, they can't charge you with murder. (Easily, at least)
They can of course use DNA typing to figure out who it was, or Dental Records (if the face wasn't beat in with a sledgehammer), but those things take time, typically measured in the space of weeks (Less for high-profile cases).
While inversely; it takes time, measured in hours, to get the hell out of dodge.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Your muscles are filled with calcium, as well as bones. Your teeth are almost entirely calcium, and your skull is dense enough that it would take many hours to dissolve it.
But that's just what I think.
-kv
-
I've heard the calcium of bones is resistant to acid- does anyone know if that's true?
-kv
Calcium is, IIRC, a buffer. Meaning it has a lot of extra protons and electrons to 'sacrifice' when attacked by either alkali or acids. This does not by any stretch mean that it's somehow immune to acid (or alkali). If you want to test it, drop a tooth or a bit of bone in a glass of cola. Coca Cola has a pH value around 2.6 or so. atleast that's what I think we measured it to, back in high school. 2.something, anyway. Further more, because it doesn't just contain phosporic acid (a strong acid, giving it the very low pH value), but also carbondioxide (which is bound in the water as a weak acid), of which there is plenty, it can accept a lot of OH- (or equivalent) before it burns out as an acid.
Still, dissolving an entire human skeleton would take a lot of the wretched stuff, and take a few days even of you had an unlimited supply. If you want something that'd probably take care of your problem a lot faster, but which would also be harder to get, and more dangerous to handle, get some flouric acid (HF), which is extremely aggresive and has a prove record of dissolving bone-matter (in technical personel, anyway).
Oh, and guess what I'm going to be using to remove the upper layers of silicon chips this next month or so.
-
Getting access to that sort of thing raises a lot of flags though.
imagine walking through home depot, with a cart filled with 160 gallons of citric acid. think anyone would notice?
if you try to get large quanties for 'personal' use, they start to ask questions, and remember faces.
if you show up a week later on the news with 'My husband dissapeared' they are going to remember you.
of course, you could always steal it... but that's always a problem in and of it's self.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Ok, how about if you own an orange orchard and you decide to just squeeze a drek-load of oranges over the body for a few months, I bet you could get enough citric accid THAT way. ;)
Gabriel, Problem Solver
-
You could get a pig farm, a la 'Snatch' (or was it lock, stock, and two smoking barrels? I always get those two mixed up)
-kv
-
I never saw either of those movies. Of course when you talk about pig farms, that scene from Hanibal does come to mind.
Gabriel
-
SNATCH!!
Gabe: Watch that movie.
-
You could just quicken an invisibility spell and hope no one trips over it or follows the smell...
-
wouldn't it light up on the astral if anyone was even looking in that dirrection?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Put a masking ward in his underpants?
-
well, there are certan critters that would still be attracted to the 'smell' of such a treat, and I'm sure they'd be munching on warded underpants as much as anything else that was rotting with it.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Or just summon a fire elemental and say, "Hey chummer, go engulf that body until there's nothing but ash left. And after you do that, I'll give you this nice big piece of coal to snack on and release you from service."
Gabriel
-
Provided it isn't a force 1 elemental...
I always figured a small force elemental was akin to a lit torch or some such.
I mean, body rating of 1 and all.
-
You really have to wonder why ANYONE would summon a Force 1 anything. Hell, just manifesting to get its instructions counts as its favor and then it takes off. What a jip.
Gabriel (I REALLY hate fire elementals)
-
Having a spirit appear to give it an order does not count as a favor. At least, any reasonable GM wouldn't.
Ever see what 6 force 1 fire elementals do in melee combat? Sure, they don't have but 3-4 dice for attack max, but they get -5 for "friends in melee" for each attack. That's a guaranteed deadly wound 6 times...
-
Still seems if you hit the lot of them with a car; it'd probibly do the whole bunch of them in.
-RuskiFace the pirate
-
That depends really on how fast the car was going. To do deadly damage to something considered hardened you'd have to be going really fast. Even disrupting them physically wouldn't stop the summoner from recalling them.
Imagine rolling Conjuring 6 against a target number of 1. You'd smoke the drain 1L easily, you'd only spend 6,000 nuyen on materials (less if you made them yourself) You'd only spend 1 hour drawing the ritual circle, and 1 hour on each elemental to summon, and you'd end up with at least 4-5 favors for each elemental. Significantly more "bang for your buck" considering only rolling 1 or 2 successes on a significantly more powerful force 6 elemental.
The target numbers stay the same if you go for force 2 elementals, twice the time and cost involved but with more potent spirits. So perhaps the best type of "horde spirit" is force 2. They get 4 points of armor against normal weapons, a combat pool of 4, and a natural attack roll of 2. They're generally faster than most unaugmented people with a base initiative of 12.
Remember also, that not only are lower force spirits easier to summon, but they are also less detectable and blend in with their summoner's aura better. I knew a street-mage who always loaded up on high-power spirits, fetishes, foci, the works. But he never realized that packing all that mojo makes you light up like a Christmas tree on the astral. I'd rather have my 3 points of automatic spirit/focus Masking give me 3 force 1 distractions with 6 favors each, than a half-concealed rating 6 monster. Discretion is always a necessity in this game.
-
yea, it's tough to pretend to be a air-conditioning repairman when you have the equivilant of a nuclear missle stuck through your astral belt-loops.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Exactly!
If you know you're not going to need that Limited Flame Armor spell or that extra Spirit focus, don't bring it with you!
-
You know, we once summoned a force 3 wind spirit, Materialized it, and oured a helmet full of Gamma-Scoploamine into the little guy then sent him through a camp full of Salish regular army. That one spirit dropped two dozen troopers in one favor. Never underestimate the power of a low-powered spirt.
Gabriel
-
hmm... very clever.
although I'm not sure the use of chemical weapons is a good idea...
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Well at the time it was all we had. I really didn't expect them to take out the troopers. I figured they would create a diversion or something. They got extra karma for that plan.
Gabriel
-
Yea, I'd give my PC's extra Karma for coming up with something like that too.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
although I'm not sure the use of chemical weapons is a good idea...
Er... biological weapons IIRC.
-
Either way.
but, if you are sitting naked in a ditch, and all you have with you equipment wise is a german army helmet filled with the latest nuro-stun VXXIV, you gotta do what you gotta do.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Spirits with telekinetic abilities are very nice.
I still remember playing with The Big Surge with my gaming group. He used a greater form sea spirit to "move" him on his surfboard at 60mph and use it's Storm powers on an off-shore oil rig taken over by pirates. It was cool.
-
You just have to think outside of the box from time to time.
Gabriel
-
Well, needless to say, a series of force 2 Sea spirits (remember you can summon multiple greater form nature spirits) can be very nasty for any of the people standing on the outside part of the oil platform...
-
Anytime runners think outside the box, it can be a lot of fun.
One run I heard of, the J hired runners to take out a guy who was hiding in the middle of a NAN sanctioned park, out on a lake in his yacht, with armed guards. What did the runenrs do? Stole a hovercraft, so they wouldn't have to waste time changing from boat to escape car.
Thinking outside the box is awesome.
-kv
-
Submarine all the way for moi!
-
LOL airdrop the sub into the lake from a T-Bird... could work, but they may notice the aproach, and with a sub, stealth is pretty much everything.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
A big, BIG missile???
Gabriel
-
LOL missles of that type are more difficult to fire, and get to than the target in question.
but your heads in a good place.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Submarine + Land Locked Lake = Bad Idea
-kv
-
Water elemental in a land-locked lake equals BIG WAVES!!!!
Gabriel
-
The same thing happens when your mom jumps in a pool! hahahahaha
just kidding. I was talking about my mom.
-Ruskiface the Pirate
-
Better watch it, chummer. Ingo is gonna get you if you keep talking about my mom like that.
Gabriel
-
no no no, it was MY mom.
I'm aloud to talk about my own mother.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Er...
Either you're allowed to talk about your mom like that, or you're a lout.
In context, aloud makes little if any sense.
-
LOL!!! You got schooled in somantics by a guy who knows English as a second language!!! ;D
Damn that's good humor!!!
Gabriel
-
Yea, make fun of the Dislexic guy for spelling phenoticly. way to go.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
dbdbdbdbpppqpdbbdqqpdbdbdbdbdbdqdpbdbdbdbdbpqpqpqdpqpdqpdpbpqpdbpqpdbpdpqdpbpdppqpd
What's the 30th letter in that string?
-
" b "
(I may be dislexic, but I'm good with computers)
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Yea, make fun of the Dislexic guy for spelling phenoticly. way to go.
I already apologiesed for doing so once, back a while when Gabe pointed out to use that he was dyslexic.
In general, your spelling is so good I haden't noticed. My apologies.
-
dbdbdbdbpppqpdbbdqqpdbdbdbdbdbdqdpbdbdbdbdbpqpqpqdpqpdqpdpbpqpdbpqpdbpdpqdpbpdppqpd
What's the 30th letter in that string?
OK, you almost got smote for that you fragger. Next time you want to give me a sesiure, warn me first. ;)
And ROOTless, please don't appoligize for that. It was too damn funy.
Gabriel
-
Yea, It's all good in the hood.
no worries mate.
I'm probibly just overly defencive on my spelling, seeing as how it takes a wee bit o effort to keep it at the level it's at.
but, i'm over it. mock away! I am ready to face the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune!
LOL
-RuskiFace the speller
-
Then stop typing "expecialy." THAT'S NOT HOW IT'S SPELLED OR PRONOUNCED!!!
Gabriel (Hey, you said to sling away. :gabe:)
-
and I knew I could trust you to step up to bat at the plate... LOL
so, Do you think they'll have spelling checkers built into computers by the next new century?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Actually, yes, I do, but because of general ignorance and apathy of the programmers, the english language will change, at least gramatically. All it takes is a few glitches programmed into the spell-check to change the mind of an entire generation.
Gabriel
-
or will we be unable to spell without the use of a spellchecker?
how long before typing 'teh' as 'the' becomes the norm, because MS Word automaticly fixes that error, so your brain never has to?
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Exaclty what is happening now. The dumbening of the Human Race.
Gabriel
-
Well, since everyone starts with a read/write skill at half their native language, that should say something.
Note, that "dumbening", is not a word.
"i am teh dumbener!!!!11eleventyone"
-
No, Dumbening is a term first uesd (to my knowledge at least) on the Simpson's to describe the slow decline in intelligence in the males of the Simpson bloodline. Considering the source and the description, I thought it appropriate on several levels to describe the trend I am talking about.
Gabriel
-
*shrug* works for me.
-RuskiFace the Dumb Pirate
-
Yes, I remember that episode.
Wonder if the Simpsons is still on in 2050?
-
hmmmm... interesting idea, but probably not. How many 80 year old tv shows do you see around us? I mean, they're even ressurecting 70's and 80's tv shows as movies, but that's nowhere near the time frame we're thinking.
What about other major brands? My group has a running joke (no matter who is GM) about McWendy-King-In-a-Box, the conglomerate from all of the fast food franchises that survived the transition to true megacorps.
What else would survive?
-kv
-
Actualy, McDonalds is McHughes, and Dominoes was renamed Dominion Pizza. But you bring up a damn good point. All you have to do is look around at today's society and try to find anything that is still kickin' that has an 80 year history. Hell, even a 50 year history would be tough to find.
Personally, I think Starbuck's will still be around, but only because this is Seattle we're talking about. Other than that, I don't know...
Gabriel
-
Hmm... a copule of shoe companies have histories that long..
probibly some grocery stores too...
no technology companys though. IBM is close, and so is Xerox, but even then...
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
IBM has roots back in the 1930s, so it is possible that tech companies would have roots that far back. Not very likely (tech companies tend to have about a 30 year life before they are absorbed by something else or fall off the SOTA curve.)
-kv
-
I need Microsoft to fall off the SOTA curve, so I can start using Linux more.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Well, we ARE shadowrunner, Ruski. How much is it worth to you for that to happen???
Gabriel
-
Actually, I think they are doing it to themselves at this point.
all I need is the Googlebox to come out.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
You may have a point.
Gabriel
-
most recent news looks like the googlebox is just going to be for china though. *shrug*
go figure.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Don't fret when you see google.analytics spying on you for "Our Land" and the great Liberation Army... Axis of evil, indeed.
-
well, from what iv'e looked into, google dosn't see the need to market computers here in america. everyone's already got one.
however, in china, they are activly persuing the computer market. they've gone into negeotions with the chinease goverment. aparently, for the ability to get a computer in there and offer an internet service (and the ADS that pay google's budget into everyone's home there) they have already developed some censorship software, so that anti-goverment propaganda won't be aloud to circulate, and are installing it on all the machines over there.
what I'm afraid of, is the next generation of google hackers from china. 8 billion people, with nothing better to do, and an oppresive goverment... *shiver*
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Oh yeah, nice wars between Japanese and Chinese hackers.
OMG!!!!111 kawaii!!!11 kekekekeke.
Or better yet: 7Ienn3m4N ^2 do0d ^_^
-
hahahahaha.
I was thinking more of them all attacking MY computer.
but they can attack each-other kung-fu style.
-RuskiFace the Pirate
-
Don't copyright any software, that's for sure...
-
the software I write, is all open source anyways.
-RuskiFace the PIrate