Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[bull30548]

I just saw that too thanks KV but mine says that smartlink only takes up one but it requires a image link (which I guess would make it take up two) where is it that it says 3?

Chummer question: How do I add these mods to the item such as contact lenses with image link, smartlink, vision enhancement (rating 3)?

Skill question:
If a character does not have Perception but has a device that increases perception (based on a sense) does that equipment modifier get added to a roll?

[Yogi]

I just saw that too thanks KV but mine says that smartlink only takes up one but it requires a image link (which I guess would make it take up two) where is it that it says 3?

Chummer question: How do I add these mods to the item such as contact lenses with image link, smartlink, vision enhancement (rating 3)?

Skill question:
If a character does not have Perception but has a device that increases perception (based on a sense) does that equipment modifier get added to a roll?

The capacity of 3 is for the cyberware version.  The rating of the cybereye (1-4) has a capacity rating (4-16).  See SR4A pg. 341 for the cyberware version of eyes and ears. 

For contacts look at SR4A pg. 333. That is where the table is for eye and ear enhancements.  (contacts, glasses, goggles, earbuds, headphones, microphone).

Rating 3 contacts can have up to three things in it (theres no capacity rating).  What you have to watch out for is the going over an availability of 12 at CharGen. 

In looking at Scarlet I goofed and put the image link in her glasses not her contacts (which still had a slot left in it.)  Skinlink does not take up a slot. 

As for the chummer question on adding enhancements to contact, glasses, etc. 

Go to the street gear section, select gear and then click on your contacts.  Add plugin, go to the drop down menu and go to the bottom.  You will see Vision enhancements which is right above vision enhancers (which is where you got the contacts, glasses, etc. in the first place)  There you can choose the enhancements you want on your contacts. 

As for the skill question even if you don't have the skill perception equipment bonuses will stack on your untrained perception check.  So that vision enhancement R3 will add 3 dice to your check. 

While the non-cybered versions can be lost taken they cost thousands less and take up no essence.  Getting tricked out eyes and ears and you can soak up between .4 and 1 for essence loss.  That's a lot for any character.  Now delta ware cybereyes R3 might be worth it.  1k times 10 for delta grade is only 10k (for the eyes themselves with no mods) at .2 essence loss.   Not a bad deal if you think about it.  It's a good thing the enhancement themselves don't also cost x10 or it would not be a good deal. 

Kv what I mentioned before about Scarlet's contact lenses could I fix that?  Move the image link to her lenses instead of her glasses.  It makes more sense having them in one. 

[kv]

Yogi, did you have room in your contacts, and this is a 'I clicked the wrong box' thing, or are you asking permission to bend the rules and load it up with everything else? (I'm at a family reunion and don't have my desktop computer with me).

I'm fine with it if this is just fixing a mistake or oversight. I'll have to ponder about it if it turns out to be the other way.

Also, the ratings for contacts at that price seem unreasonable, until you count in GM deviousness ("Roll for knockdown... Ooh, a glitch?"), the fact that you can't wear contacts forever without stabbing over your eyeballs, and the fact that you can't really recharge them once you've worn them for three days straight. So I will warn you, abusing contacts may come back to bite you.

I should also mention (in my non-GM voice) that there are some great resources out there, especially for new GMs. Bull, if you're interested, there are some great 'cheat sheets' over at pavao.org/shadowrun/cheatsheets/ which are really helpful when it comes to figuring out which dice to roll and what the rolls mean.

I refer to them a lot, especially when there are new players or characters taking on an unfamiliar role in the group.

  - kv

[bull30548]

Sweet thanks KV. I will be honest I have come up with the main plot as the runners versus a corporation. Now I am making notes for other runs and even just little jobs that fit with beginners. Mainly cause I can't always get the players to take the run I want them to. I also plan on taking contacts to a new level. Instead of just poking them when they want the contacts throw them data points. If the player follows up with the data points could be pay data, equipment, or a simple job on the other end. That way I give any non hackers a way to get pay days like them. Plus it helps define the contacts a bit better. You aren't going to call a lone star cop to find out where to score some guns unless you really got him over a barrel.  Also I can craft rumors and jobs to sort of circle them back around to the main plot if need be.

So I created the Corp and have the upper management named and titled. I just got to hammer them out. Probably going to use generic stats from the books for the drones. I also plan on dropping a prime runner in the mix just to put them on edge.

[Yogi]

Yogi, did you have room in your contacts, and this is a 'I clicked the wrong box' thing, or are you asking permission to bend the rules and load it up with everything else? (I'm at a family reunion and don't have my desktop computer with me).

I'm fine with it if this is just fixing a mistake or oversight. I'll have to ponder about it if it turns out to be the other way.

Also, the ratings for contacts at that price seem unreasonable, until you count in GM deviousness ("Roll for knockdown... Ooh, a glitch?"), the fact that you can't wear contacts forever without stabbing over your eyeballs, and the fact that you can't really recharge them once you've worn them for three days straight. So I will warn you, abusing contacts may come back to bite you.

  - kv

They are rating 3 contacts with the flare comp and smartlink enhancements.  There still is a slot left in them for Image link.  There's no rule bending going on.  Just an oversight on my part. 

I agree on the cost effectiveness.  For a fraction of the cost why would one want cybereyes over contacts and glasses with enhancements in them.  Yeah one takes chances of loosing them but they are readily available in a pinch at the corner store so to speak. 

Question though how would one recharge contact lenses?  Is it even possible?  Probably with 2072 technology they have a way.  One possible solution could be that they run off the body's own electrical current thus not needing a recharge per say but work as long as they are "on the eye".  Maybe a reason for the skinlink mod for such things.   Though you still run into the trouble of wearing them for long periods of time like you mentioned.   

It's late here and I think I'm starting to ramble.  So with that said I'm off to bed. 

[bull30548]

Well essence loss isn't a big deal unless you are a technomancer or magic user. Even a little pink on essence is a full point against you.  It is a pretty big deal for them because it affects everything as well as initiation. Now there is also budgetary concerns as delta ware is exactly readily available still but they took out the availability increase on it.  Though it seems that they balance this with regular availability of cyberware no matter the level. Also sometimes you want to supplement (or stack) as many abilities as possible. A good example is stacking the contacts with goggles that way yogurt a ton of visual enhancers but don't have to spend magic spells or adept power son it and you can sell off the equipment as you get those powers.

[Ingo Monk]

Well essence loss isn't a big deal unless you are a technomancer or magic user. Even a little pink on essence is a full point against you.  It is a pretty big deal for them because it affects everything as well as initiation. Now there is also budgetary concerns as delta ware is exactly readily available still but they took out the availability increase on it.  Though it seems that they balance this with regular availability of cyberware no matter the level. Also sometimes you want to supplement (or stack) as many abilities as possible. A good example is stacking the contacts with goggles that way yogurt a ton of visual enhancers but don't have to spend magic spells or adept power son it and you can sell off the equipment as you get those powers.

Only regular and alphaware grade cyber is available for purchase at chargen, barring GM custom rulings.  See bolded green line below.

While the non-cybered versions can be lost taken they cost thousands less and take up no essence.  Getting tricked out eyes and ears and you can soak up between .4 and 1 for essence loss.  That's a lot for any character.  Now delta ware cybereyes R3 might be worth it.  1k times 10 for delta grade is only 10k (for the eyes themselves with no mods) at .2 essence loss.   Not a bad deal if you think about it.  It's a good thing the enhancement themselves don't also cost x10 or it would not be a good deal. 

Actually you DO have to pay 10x for the mods for deltaware.  See bolded orange line below.

Cyberware and Bioware Grades
Cyberware and bioware is available in four grades: standard, alphaware, betaware, and deltaware. Only standard and alphaware may be purchased at character creation. The prices for cyberware and bioware presented in this chapter are for standard ’ware. When purchasing implants of other grades, apply the Essence Cost and Cost adjustments as noted on the Implant Grades table (bottom right).
Note that cyberware accessories must be of the same grade as the implant they are added to.

[Yogi]

 

Actually you DO have to pay 10x for the mods for deltaware.  See bolded orange line below.

Cyberware and Bioware Grades
Cyberware and bioware is available in four grades: standard, alphaware, betaware, and deltaware. Only standard and alphaware may be purchased at character creation. The prices for cyberware and bioware presented in this chapter are for standard ’ware. When purchasing implants of other grades, apply the Essence Cost and Cost adjustments as noted on the Implant Grades table (bottom right).
Note that cyberware accessories must be of the same grade as the implant they are added to.

Dam, I've had that wrong for a long time.  Not that I've played a 4e game long enough to get alpha,beta or delta ware goodies.

Thanks for pointing that out Ingo.

[Ingo Monk]

Thanks for pointing that out Ingo.

No problem, I had someone do that to me in a game before.

[bull30548]

So this is a house rule I have come up with that I am going to present to my players.  It is usually called a wild die and it is used to supplement the fates of chance.  I plan on issuing regular Karma awards as outlined in the books.  However I also will add the karma die itself cause well I like my players being able to bulk up so to speak.  So what I am going to propose to the players is this I will award karma and then either I or them individually will roll one d6 die.  Whatever that die is that is your extra Karma reward.  Hence karma (or luck) is coming back at you.  I see my players going for one die roll from one person because it is balanced and fair to everyone.

Thoughts? Comments?

The way that Shadowrun was originally ran was that we didn't get Karma until the end of a run and then it was tallied up and pow there is your Karma.  We had many a clusterf*** runs with us so the run sometimes felt like it never ended.  When it eventually did we were 10 to 20 sessions into the game and we came out with about 30-80 karma on the back end.  I want to try and award karma every session (because I see a lot of delay between sessions) and also to begin with the runs are going to be pretty simple.  I will be honest this group with out me and the other person in it usually has the tactical ability of a hammer.  It's a good tool but then everything looks like a nail.

[Ingo Monk]

So this is a house rule I have come up with that I am going to present to my players.  It is usually called a wild die and it is used to supplement the fates of chance.  I plan on issuing regular Karma awards as outlined in the books.  However I also will add the karma die itself cause well I like my players being able to bulk up so to speak.  So what I am going to propose to the players is this I will award karma and then either I or them individually will roll one d6 die.  Whatever that die is that is your extra Karma reward.  Hence karma (or luck) is coming back at you.  I see my players going for one die roll from one person because it is balanced and fair to everyone.

Thoughts? Comments?

The way that Shadowrun was originally ran was that we didn't get Karma until the end of a run and then it was tallied up and pow there is your Karma.  We had many a clusterf*** runs with us so the run sometimes felt like it never ended.  When it eventually did we were 10 to 20 sessions into the game and we came out with about 30-80 karma on the back end.  I want to try and award karma every session (because I see a lot of delay between sessions) and also to begin with the runs are going to be pretty simple.  I will be honest this group with out me and the other person in it usually has the tactical ability of a hammer.  It's a good tool but then everything looks like a nail.

Karma is a big deal for players, it will keep them hooked into their characters.  I tend to side toward session rewards vs. end-of-run rewards, it allows them to have usable karma and inhibits the off chance that they die before they can use any.

Back on topic, if you can handle high-karma characters then I'd say go for it.  At first it won't be that big of a deal, but a few sessions in you'll realize how much better they are than when they started.  Also I'd recommend you be up front with whether or not the rule of six applies to this karma bonus roll.

[bull30548]

Yeah, that is why I posted that up here and I think you have a point I don't think I should mess with it.  I mean in the beginning it like a slow crawl but as time goes on it can really build up and suddenly the guy who couldn't hit a step van can now shoot the wing off of a flying sparrow.  So yeah I think it will leave it be.

Thanks again on the help on watermarks and chummer help.  Speaking of chummer I was playing around with it (using the plugin suggestion) and it actually scales the cyberware up to delta ware when you do it that way.  However I did not test to see if it would let me scale down without getting mad at me. 

[bull30548]

So instead of dragging the OCC through this thought I post this here.  How does hacking a drone in SR4 work now?

[Yogi]

It's pretty extensive.

This may/should help.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/13885700/Hacking%20the%20Matrix%200.16.doc

It's pretty extensive.

[kv]

This is the majority of what Ingo and I were discussing, cited with relevant references:

My understanding on the Matrix is still a bit foggy, so here's some discussion for you:

(Hacking on the fly)

Such brute force hacks can attract attention. Each time you take a Hack on the
Fly action, the target node makes a free roll on an Analyze + Firewall (hacker’s Stealth)
Extended Test. If the node detects you an alert is triggered, even if you have succeeded in
your attempt (Alerts, p. 238).

Incidentally I should have read this part better.  Without a logged in hacker/rigger a node gets an automatic chance to detect me vs my Stealth program.  But as you recall my base "suite" of apps does not include Stealth so does that mean it automatically knows?  Or in this case, an automatic alert.

All of this is beside the point, because there's a hacker logged into the node.  They'll see the alert as soon as it's popped up.

There are two types of active alerts in a Matrix node. A general alert applies
to the entire node, and occurs when an alert is issued by a user on suspicion
of intrusion, without knowing who or what is actually exploiting the
node. A restricted alert is more common, and is directed at a single icon
or group of icons. Spiders try to use restricted alerts as much as possible,
because they offer a bonus for the node against the target. A general alert
may become a restricted alert when the spiders or IC find their intruder.

Generally speaking, alerts caused by the Firewall finding a hacking
user or by discovery of the hacker by IC or an agent are restricted alerts, and those caused by glitches or discovery of hacked data or devices are
general alerts.

So it's an automatic restricted alert vs me, giving the node +4 firewall whenever I have to test against it.

Alert Response
A node on alert status has verified an intrusion or other unauthorized
activity. Most nodes are programmed to automatically alert security
personnel or the owner/user of the device when an alert is triggered.
If the node contains security hackers (or if there are any on call), they
will be alerted and will come looking for the interloper.
A node on a restricted alert receives a Firewall bonus of +4 against
the intruder that triggered the alert. This applies to all tests made by or
against the node’s Firewall. General alerts do not convey a bonus, but still
notify security personnel and take other actions as configured in the node.
The node may also do one of the following, either as chosen by the
gamemaster or randomly determined on the Random Alert Response
Table, below.

Essentially, the node will launch IC vs me if the drone had IC for any reason.  Otherwise it will try to sever my connection:

Terminate Conn ection
Once an intruder is identified and a restricted alert issued, a node with this
response attempts to sever the hacker’s connection by shutting down the
port through which he is accessing the node. In order to sever a connection,
the node immediately makes a Firewall + System (hacker’s Exploit
rating, Combat Turn) Extended Test. The system adds a dice pool modifier
of +1 for each IC launched following the alert. The hacker’s Exploit
rating is modified by +2 if he’s using a security account, or +4 if he’s using
an admin account. If the hacker used a passcode and legitimate account to
log on, rather than hacking his way in with an exploit program, then the
Exploit program does not apply to the test. If the node achieves more hits,
it disconnects the hacker. The hacker can attempt to log back on, but the
node will be on alert (and may have closed down all outside connections).

So now it tries to roll it's Firewall (+4) + System vs my Exploit of 4 (+4 if I got in with admin account) extended test in combat turns.

This all happens as the very next pass I would assume.

At that point the logged in hacker could either initiate Matrix combat with me if I'm in the node (drone) while the drone is pulling off all that stuff above....




WAIT A MINUTE



reading the wrong section:

Hacking and Spoofing
Another way to fight a rigger is to take control of her drones. Hacking
a drone can give you full control over it. The drawback to hacking is
that it takes time. Spoofing is faster, but limited in what you can do.
Spoofing also requires that you have the rigger’s access ID, which may
necessitate the Track program if she is in a remote location. Still, a
single command, such as “unload your weapon” or “reboot” can take
a drone out of a fight.
Such hijacking attempts against your drones can be foiled by
jumping into a device. A jumped-in rigger overrides any other control
of the drone, including by its Pilot.

If the hacker/rigger is jumped-in the drone my hack automatically fails by my understanding of that passage.  If they were commanding it while subscribed we would use all that drivel I wrote above hahaha.

At this point I think all I can really do is try and Jam on the fly.

Jamming on the Fly
More than almost any other character, riggers are dependent
on wireless signals in order to use their specialty, which means
that few riggers are strangers to electronic warfare. Sometimes
you need to shut down another rigger or hacker and don’t have a
jammer available; in such circumstances you do the best that you
can with whatever radio or wireless transmitter you have on hand,
spitting static into whatever channels or bands the opposition is
using. Jamming on the fly tends to be a noisy and difficult affair,
but it can work—and that’s the important thing.
Jamming on the fly is a Complex Action and requires some
device with a Signal rating (such as a commlink, radio, or drone)
to act as an impromptu jammer. Make an Opposed Test between
the rigger’s Electronic Warfare skill + Signal rating and the target’s
Electronic Warfare + Signal rating; the target adds the rating of any ECCM program she has running to her dice pool for the test. If
the Opposed Test is successful, the signal is jammed; otherwise it is
unaffected. Jamming on the fly is area jamming and affects a spherical
area—the impromptu jammer’s Signal rating is reduced by 1 for
every five meters from the centre.
A device being used as an impromptu jammer cannot use its
wireless capability for anything else. A commlink, for example,
could not connect to the Matrix at the same time it is being used
as an impromptu jammer.

So my EWAR skill of 2 + Signal of 6 vs that hackers EWAR + Signal + ECCM.

Wow this is a lot more involved than I thought!  Good thing I picked a hacker, this is actually pretty interesting to figure all this stuff out.